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Author Topic: Help a bad titan become a good titan!  (Read 9127 times)
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unbeatableloser
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« on: August 06, 2012, 05:13:39 AM »

Ok so recently I've been playing Island Defense, and I've been sticking with playing titan. And yes, since I am a noob titan, I've been losing, a lot, a whole lot. Haven't been able to win a single game as titan even though I have been frequently playing.

I always die to some uber strong, well defended base. I don't know what I can do to prevent this, or counter it.

I've read all of the titan guides here on this site, watched videos/replays on youtube, I do see a slight improvement in my titan gameplay, but still being stumped by those overpowered bases, or even those stronger builders that are able to take my titan's attacks, like mag.

As a titan player, I have tried just about every titan EXCEPT for...idk his name but his model is the Crypt Lord (hero). I usually go random just for the extra gold and the random extra item. But is it worth it?

Heres the basic rundown of what happens just about every game:

When I pick my titan, I do sell my ankh of reincarnation, and purchase webbed feet if i didnt already get it from the random item, and a pearl, and thats all i ever have enough gold for. I then use pearl to find any lumber bases nearby, and when my titan nears their base I pearl once more so I can nuke (Unless im a titan that doesnt have to target a unit like the Hyrda Titan) the builder's workers for easy exp. Then proceed to destroy the lumber base for the gold. While doing this, right as I take a foot of the mid titan base, my map makes the red dot and there are a lot of workers mining gold. I know to Ctrl + 1 on the punishment center to quickly tp my titan back to the base, but usually all the builders are gone by then, its very rare for me to kill anybody, only thing i manage to do is shoo away the annoying builders but as soon as i leave they come back yet again.

It's by this time when I pearl I'll find one of the builders have a large base, with multiple walls backed up by an army of towers, I of course try to take these bases down ASAP but I almost never succeed as I have only the strength to destroy 2-3 maybe 4 walls before retreating back to heal, only to return to their bases with fresh new walls again. And while this was happening, the other builders manage to get even more gold, and soon another strong base is set up, and another, and so on. Basically leaving with me nothing as the builders taunt and laugh at how weak I am, its frustrating!

So I'm asking anyone to give me some real advice here, and to not just troll and insult, that's not helpful.

Heres what I know/think im doing right:

- Sell my ankh of recarnation for a pearl, and buy webbed feet as starter items
- Ctrl +1 the Punishment building to easily teleport titan, and take control of minions.
- Use minions (on the rare occassion I actually get one) for extra nuke damage, to snipe builders, and/or to heal me while I siege a base.
- Use Titan's nuke on builder workers for fast and easy exp for titan.
- I read somewhere here that its always better to get healing and regen items than damage items like a force trident, so I sometimes do that.
- I try NOT to kill builders early and try to use them as additional feed.

Heres what I WANT to know:
- When should I kill a builder for early minion to camp gold mine? Is it better to use said builder for feed? or to deny gold?
- General Item Suggestions?
- How to keep titan constantly attacking walls of bases? He always tends to get out of control when this happens.
- Assuming I don't have a minion, whats a good balance of sieging and denying gold? I player told me I should stop wasting my time in mid, so I took this players advice and constantly sieged bases, and kill anything I could, this resulted in builders getting tons of gold, which of course made them have strong bases, which results in me dieing.
- How to prevent builders from constantly rebuilding walls?
- Wards, people always suggest wards for titan, why? Everytime I put a ward, i try to put it behind me but the towers are always able to snipe my ward.
- How to deal with the following builders: Satyr, his constant invisibility makes him a hard target to kill, Mag and tauren, both tanky builders that idk how to beat, panda, he always splits into his three little mini pandas.
- Any other advice I should know about?
- Maybe additional videos, guides for playing titan in Island Defense

Oh and please don't tell me to instead play builder, because I do not like playing builder as much as titan, yes I think playing titan is fun, its just frustrating that I can never win though, and have people constantly smack talk in chat. I'm not asking to be the best titan here, I just want to be good enough to give players a challenge.

Thanks for taking the time to read my post, any advice given is greatly appriciated! Thanks in advance.

Oh and you can also contact me in-game, I'm always on a lot of the time, since I have to also be active in my ladder clan.

Username: Unbeatableloser (same as my forum username)
Realm: US WEST, Lordaeron


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ArtFuL
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« Reply #1 on: August 06, 2012, 10:44:00 AM »

Quote
Heres what I WANT to know:
- When should I kill a builder for early minion to camp gold mine? Is it better to use said builder for feed? or to deny gold?
• I would kill supportive builders like demo or mag. Once they got gold, they'll cause you problems. Plus, they won't really feed you.
- General Item Suggestions?
• Titanic Triends and wards (not the titan wards or w/e they are called - eternal wards (?) )
- How to keep titan constantly attacking walls of bases? He always tends to get out of control when this happens.
• Right Click on the wall, click with mini clicks in front of the walls to be exactly in front of it = vision. Use shift on walls in vision.
- Assuming I don't have a minion, whats a good balance of sieging and denying gold? I player told me I should stop wasting my time in mid, so I took this players advice and constantly sieged bases, and kill anything I could, this resulted in builders getting tons of gold, which of course made them have strong bases, which results in me dieing.
• Finding the balance always depends on the players' skill and builders, in my opinion. Get 1 or 2 lumberbases and try tramping them with tp. In general you shouldn't do that (like killing 1,2 lbs and then going middle, killing next 2 lbs and then returning to middle again), instead trying to trap them with wards/wands when are they're going back (after you tp), or you simply attack walls, in case they poke you, place a ward. For sats, simple click in front of the walls, the titan will attack the wall and if the sat pokes you, the titan will automatically attack him - should not be used for normal builders)
- How to prevent builders from constantly rebuilding walls?
• Be exactly in front of it, move fast via click on the pos of the wall/place an item/ward. Just be fast, lol
- Wards, people always suggest wards for titan, why? Everytime I put a ward, i try to put it behind me but the towers are always able to snipe my ward.
• Towers can't kill your towers. Use them as a strategie or to win. -- Don't place the ward like a retard, use your brain. Placing it next to you where a hunter or builder can kill it, is retarded. Check the base: Where're the units, which way is the longest for a builder to kill it/reach it? Which would be good to get the builders near the entrance so you can nuke/bounce them?
- How to deal with the following builders: Satyr, his constant invisibility makes him a hard target to kill, Mag and tauren, both tanky builders that idk how to beat, panda, he always splits into his three little mini pandas.
• There's so much to say... As i said for sat in early game, try the wall-method, doesn't success always. Use your brain and well placed pearls. Don't forget PUNISH PUNISH PUNISH on your titan to disable mag's and tauren's slow. use your BRAIN to hunt the panda. Try to understand where it would be save for him and kill HIM! It's really not hard.
- Any other advice I should know about?
BE FAST, USE PUNISH, USE YOUR BRAIN, DON'T BE RETARDED = WIN WIN WIN
- Maybe additional videos, guides for playing titan in Island Defense
• Youtube : Island defense (guides)
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unbeatableloser
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« Reply #2 on: August 06, 2012, 04:44:51 PM »

Thanks for the advice Smiley Helpful stuff. Think you have a typo though, "towers can't kill your towers"? I have towers? haha I know what you mean.

I actually won my first game last night haha, however I got banned for rage quitting an earlier game :/ kinda sux because BGN is the only place that hosts ID in my realm. Oh well, I'll be back as a titan in 3 more days.

Alrite I'll try to place my wards better. And I'll try this wall method.

And I'll definitely try to use my brain more haha, and I'll try to be faster, I usually am slow because of when I buy items.

Thanks again Smiley
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ArtFuL
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« Reply #3 on: August 06, 2012, 06:55:23 PM »

I meant towers can't kill your wards, only units can.

And Maize-Bot is off, else you could join there :/ Anyway, have fun and good luck.

Follow the four things i capitalized and you win ^.^
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Coaster_Man
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« Reply #4 on: August 06, 2012, 08:16:46 PM »

There are lots of little tricks you can do as titan to kill builders easily quickly, but aren't quite so easy to perform.
These tricks include:
Ward blocking - You place a ward behind just in front of a builder as he enters the small gap between the walls, which blocks him from escaping, then you walk up to him as close you can and block the other side. From here you can melee him. Windwalk can go through wards though, so keep that in mind. I suggest getting eternal wards as your first item after your Pearl and Webbed Feet. This item is just too useful to pass up. P.S. Some builders are good and understand ward blocks, if you already have your eternal wards and you find another Healing Ward while you are killing stuff, keep it for a double ward block. This is when you place the first ward, begin attacking the builder, and if he kills your ward to escape, you place the second one. Or if the builder has 2 exits to go into, you block both. Builders never expect two wards, because it costs the titan 5-2 gold, depending if you found it or bought it.

Wand of the Wind - There are a few uses for this one. The first use is simply to catch up to builders, as it has a good range (700-800) and throws the builder up into the air for 5 seconds. Usually though, if you do this at the middle, other builders will use their debuffs on you (such as Mag's Frostbite) so be prepared. Also, because this tosses them into the air for 5 seconds, if you use it on a satyr right after he dashes, when he lands his dash will be over, because it lasts less than 5 seconds. Against a Murloc's panic, however, it will not diminish the entire panic because panic lasts 10 seconds. You need 2 wotw for this.
The second use of the wotw is much more tricky, and it helps to have a very low delay for this (required is <0.5 seconds, unless you can think ahead). The wotw can cancel a teleport from any unit, such as a makrura or murloc, even a magnataur with a teleport staff. Sometimes in games I find a murloc lumber base early, and it only has 1 exit (the one I am coming from) and so the murloc has to teleport to escape safely. However since this murloc wants to deny all possible feed, he waits for the last second, hitting his shelters and whatnot. This is where you walk up to him with your WotW ready, and the second he teleports you click it on him. Be ready for murlocs to panic after this though.

Bounce Nuking and Fog Nuking - Many of the titans and their minions have a chain lightning modded nuke. This means that the nuke will simply bounce to the nearest visible target, if it is in range. You must use this to your advantage when sieging a base, or when killing people at the middle. Let's say, for example, that you teleport to the middle, and happen to get 2 hits on a huntress before she dashes away. You see the direction she dashes, and so you pearl ahead and follow her. But now she is past the walls, sitting there regening HP, and out of nuke range. Oh, but her magnataur ally sits in between you and the huntress, giving a perfect bounce nuke option. You nuke the mag, it bounces to the low hp huntress, and you have yourself a minion.
Fog Nuking - Fog nuking abuses the chain lightning's tendency to only hit visible targets. Let's say that, for exmaple, you have a builder sitting in his base and he has a row of workers behind him. x= worker o=builder
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
x      o                                                   Normally if you nuke the bottom leftmost worker, it will just bounce to the next worker and the next worker because they are the closest targets. However if you purchase  
x                                                          floating eye, you can position it such that you are only seeing 4 (or less) workers and the builder. Now when you get your double nuke (level 2 for 155 dmg each) off the                                                
                                                            worker, it will bounce to the few workers in sight, then hit the builder and kill him.
What is double nuking? Or syncro nuking as some call it? This is when you shoot multiple nukes very quickly at one target, sometimes a target that would die in 1 nuke. How does this work? Well a bouncing nuke is simply chain lightning, which is not instant. In fact it has a projectile speed (like 100000 or something, it's fast). What you do here is have your multiple minions ready in your selection, in range, and then do the following very quickly: Q -> Click -> Tab -> Repeat. Q is the hotkey for every titan's nuke in the game, and all the minions. Clicking is.... clicking the builder.. And then Tab will select the next unit type OR the next hero, in this case, in your selection. If you practice this you can get 2 nukes off 50hp workers down pretty easily, or bounce it off a crab, skink, or albatross. Getting 3 isn't so easy, and you either have to practice a lot, have super fast hands, or use other methods such as phoenix nuking/chimaera nuking.

Early kills as Syph/Foss/Breeze/Bubo: These titans don't require vision to nuke their target, or target zone they aim, which is really good. What you do here is at the very beginning, if you happen to random one of these you sell your ankh, buy your pearl, and feet, and then pearl just a bit up and right of the mound, far enough that the seed immediately to the right is in vision. This seed is very commonly used by huntresses, but mostly mags. If you see a mag there, gg you have a mini. What you do is buy a Replenishment Potion, and then walk over to the seed, positioning your titan right in front of the exit so he can't walk out. There is no way he has windwalk yet, so don't worry. If it is a huntress you have to place your feet or pearl on the ground in the seed so he can't windwalk away (windwalked units can't run through items). From here it's easy, nuke and nuke and nuke some more until the builder is dead. If you run out of mana, simply use your potion. A 4 gold investment is definitely worth that 10-20g + minion early.

Ok, now for general titan game play since that was a lot of tricky things. This is how I generally play, and I generally win, however take in mind these are random games off of BGN where, no offense, but the players are not very good (at all). However sometimes there are  a few decent players, these are the ones who properly base/make full denies.

First thing first I random, for that extra gold bonus and the chance of the extra item. I sell the ankh and buy a pearl/feet and use the pearl for reasons stated above, if I happen to be that titan. Otherwise I buy a wotw in addition. Start pearling around and running around, if you see a demon out in the open trying to build food sources/deny them, go windwalk him and kill him. If he tries to nether out, just nuke him when he is in his nether state, you will do more damage and kill him. Always kill whoever you find first for that minion. The builders having no gold is very useful, and the minion itself is also great for casting pearls and helping you trap people on the run or nuke later. I would actually kill everyone you can for all those minions, because more minions equals more nukes or heals, and a big strong base is nothing without walls. The second they go to wall you move your minions forward to scare them, if they wall anyways you nuke and base is gone.
The second non-starter item I get is a magic coral, because that mana bonus is vital for nuking lumber bases/seeds for exp. Also it is used in both MSOG recipe and Life Essence, and I almost always get life essence, because its mana regen aura for your minions is so good when you are sieging for heals, or nukes. From here I get life essence, armor of fate, and titanic wards if I have several minions. Note that these wards are passable, meaning each unit has its own unique cooldown for the wards. So if you give the wards to a minion after using it on your titan, it will have no cooldown for that minion.
These are the items I generally get if I am most of the titans, but there are a few different builders for specific titans. As almost any titan, when you are leveling always put more points into heal and not nuke. Nuke is useless to have at level 3 on your titan, use your minions for that. For example as Moltenious you can have a level 4 heal at level 7, and still have your windwalk and nuke level 2 or bird. Having a 950 hitpoint heal at level 7 is insane!

If I get Granit,  don't get mana things, because this titan doesn't really cast spells. I would go all tridents for damage, and the ward of course for healing.  This titan's heal is just another ward, and wards heal 2% of your heal per second. So the more health you have, the more healing they do. Tridents give you +Strength, which gives you more health. So if you have lots of tridents, your heal is better as this titan. However his minions have a bouncing heal, so life essence is good too, but now we're spending too much gold so you have to choose. If you happen to choose the trident build with granit, and you have a LOT of damage and extra gold, but you can't defeat a base because it has huge damage, I suggest getting Abysmal Waters, because it makes you invulnerable to everything for 5 seconds, which is amazing if you kill walls in 1-2 seconds. As foss you can go either regen or damage. Regen if they don't have invis seeing capabilities, or damage if they do. Getting an armor of fate helps you survive without regen. I wouldn't go life essence style with foss since his minions nukes suck for killing wallers and they can't heal him (except for cocoon which only has an initial mana cost).

When sieging a base with many minions I bring all the minions with me, because noobier players will allow the some towers to attack the minions, mitigating that extra damage to my main titan. Also they are there for the wards, and heals/nukes. I would always suggest getting level 1 nuke, windwalk, then all heal for your minions IF they are minions whose heal affects other targets. If you are doing badly somewhat and there are really strong bases, and you only have 1 minion + your titan, get it to level 3 and get nuke to level 2 so you can bounce nuke and kill the builder.

Ok that was a big wall of text, but the funny thing is there are still a lot more strategies to go on about, but I'll let someone else do that I suppose.



« Last Edit: August 06, 2012, 08:34:53 PM by Coaster_Man » Logged

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PoNy
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« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2012, 07:14:31 AM »

I like to end my games fast, and that means before a strong base goes up.

To go about with this strategy that only works in pubs I take any minion available without thought.

First minion to camp for a while at gold to scare off builders and then proceed to move him to the tip of a hill so that builders trying to base in that location will die the second they walk up the ramp.

Make sure to always pearl in intersections, do not pearl on top of bases instead make use of the huge radius of pearl and try to hit 2-3 lumber bases for maximum vision.

Don't camp early on and use a movement pattern that moves you up and down while moving through the gold area to pick up some items or to scare off builders.

Teleport when ever it is up to keep builders away from gold even for a second.

Get a magic coral. With magic coral, webbed feet and pearl you are set until a base goes up giving you movement speed a good mana pool and regen with a form of scouting.

Any additional minions should be camped at the tip of hills as well, camp them in bases you hate sieging.

I usually have one minion go for the nuke path to take down builders while the rest go heal, always pick up their wind walk very vital.

Level 2 nuke + level 2 nuke will kill 300 health no magic resist builders. Glacious minions are special because they can rush straight to level 3 nuke without hitting level 5 but as such their nukes are weaker.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2012, 07:16:26 AM by PoNy » Logged

QQmoreblub
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« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2012, 01:40:01 AM »

coaster da Uber titan!!! last time i saw coaster titaning all rq xd XXD
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DreamX7
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« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2012, 04:56:45 AM »

there are numerous guide out there that can definitely help u. google is your friend. use her. http://lmgtfy.com/?q=island+defense+titan+guides

yokola95 also has a guide.
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jeffdbckly
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« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2012, 08:07:32 AM »

Thank you for the link, newcomers always find difficulty to find this kind of matter...
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