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Author Topic: Voltron Blink  (Read 5384 times)
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Ryld
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« on: May 21, 2012, 11:43:16 PM »

Voltron's blink needs to be addressed. Me and Cambrioleuse today played a game today where a titan was able to stall and mass tomes off our wall gold feed since he could blink away, windwalk or teleport every time he sieged. The thread is obviously not about ww and tele, but the cooldown of the blink skill. It needs to be raised significantly or have an increased casting time. This titan could stall forever while still growing stronger, and was in no danger even with a morphling who at one point had 50 armor and a radio base with full rapids, mana towers, the whole shebang. Thoughts?


ALSO MBOT ADMINS:

Make game stalling bannable
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ArtFuL
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« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2012, 08:05:04 AM »

ALSO MBOT ADMINS:

Make game stalling bannable
in some cases it is. depends on the titan's general actions (e.g titan obv lost but keeps farming useless walls somewhere on the map)
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PoNy
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« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2012, 08:59:51 AM »

ALSO MBOT ADMINS:

Make game stalling bannable
in some cases it is. depends on the titan's general actions (e.g titan obv lost but keeps farming useless walls somewhere on the map)
So sieging a base to slowly get walls so you can get strong enough to break siege will become bannable?
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relaets
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« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2012, 09:36:35 AM »

So sieging a base to slowly get walls so you can get strong enough to break siege will become bannable?

He made the same depth every single time he attacked for the next hour+.....
I was able to make enough light energy towers to get 51 armour......

The titan should nearly always be able to win a game because of tomes since he infinitely scales while the builders do not.


----

Slowly in this case is on the order of many hours. You shouldn't have to wait many hours for the game to end.
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Metall-Drago
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« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2012, 12:56:40 PM »

fixing the problem: leave if titan is stalling and join another game, ez
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PoNy
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« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2012, 03:16:51 PM »

He clearly wasn't stalling, you guys just lack the ability to kill him because blink is ridiculously good.
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Ryld
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« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2012, 03:22:42 PM »

He clearly wasn't stalling, you guys just lack the ability to kill him because blink is ridiculously good.

not sure if trolling or just slow
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Frankjg
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« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2012, 05:12:31 PM »

Last I checked, giving the titan enough for his ultimate was SUPPOSED to end the game.
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PoNy
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« Reply #8 on: May 22, 2012, 07:47:24 PM »

He clearly wasn't stalling, you guys just lack the ability to kill him because blink is ridiculously good.

not sure if trolling or just slow

O I completely understand what you're implying

Blink has a low cool down which allowed he titan to siege the outer walls of the base repeatedly farming gold without danger. But if he was attacking a base then how do you justify that as stalling? Yea sure he may have pulled out quickly I wasn't there so I wouldn't know but clearly your base was amazingly awesome as expected from a player of your standing and he could barely get close.
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relaets
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« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2012, 07:55:34 PM »

If you have nearly 1000 damage a hit and you cannot break a base after seiging for over an hour you lost.
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Ryld
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« Reply #10 on: May 22, 2012, 09:29:27 PM »

He clearly wasn't stalling, you guys just lack the ability to kill him because blink is ridiculously good.

not sure if trolling or just slow

O I completely understand what you're implying

Blink has a low cool down which allowed he titan to siege the outer walls of the base repeatedly farming gold without danger. But if he was attacking a base then how do you justify that as stalling? Yea sure he may have pulled out quickly I wasn't there so I wouldn't know but clearly your base was amazingly awesome as expected from a player of your standing and he could barely get close.

Its easy to justify it as stalling. He never legitimately committed to sieging the base. He would blink out before any danger or attacks could be done to him. If you repeatedly throw everything you have at a base and you don't break it, at some point stalling to try to win by attrition and time should be addressed. We had inhouse rules about this back in the day, don't see why we can't set up some rule for stalling as it is pretty easy to recognize whether a titan is truely trying to break the base or is trying to survive and not win
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Frankjg
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« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2012, 10:39:26 PM »

I wouldn't call farming stalling. While he's farming you have so many available chances to finish him off. A 50 armor mag and a shit ton of rapids tells me that you were fed beyond belief. That also means that for him to get anywhere close to your base means either you fed him or he was farming for a ridiculous amount of time.

Not be be a dick, but either of those situations are your own fault.
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Monkeysmine
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« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2012, 10:44:06 PM »

he was farming for a ridiculous amount of time.
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Frankjg
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« Reply #13 on: May 22, 2012, 11:03:53 PM »

he was farming for a ridiculous amount of time.
Not be be a dick, but either of those situations are your own fault.
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Monkeysmine
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« Reply #14 on: May 22, 2012, 11:07:28 PM »

he was farming for a ridiculous amount of time.
Not be be a dick, but either of those situations are your own fault.

Tell me what you would do against a titan that is farming only 1-2 walls at a time for an hour and running away when it has half hp? There's no conceivable way to kill a titan in that way. You can't wall in because it'll blink. I don't think you really understand how the game is played.
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Frankjg
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« Reply #15 on: May 22, 2012, 11:10:29 PM »

If the first two walls are enough to bring him to half hp outside of the base, use only two layers of walls. Have your 50 armor mag repair.

No feed! Amazing!
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Monkeysmine
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« Reply #16 on: May 22, 2012, 11:32:52 PM »

If the first two walls are enough to bring him to half hp outside of the base, use only two layers of walls. Have your 50 armor mag repair.

No feed! Amazing!

Morph* and I don't understand how to do that. If the titan can kill a wall in two or three hits in a little more than 1/2 or 1/3 hp damage per hit, then what the fuck does repairing do? Answer: nothing. Can you deny the wall? No, because you can't do the same amount of damage the titan can. Again, you don't understand how to play the game.
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Frankjg
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« Reply #17 on: May 22, 2012, 11:49:28 PM »

You're not hearing me. You're supposed to do this from the start to prevent him from being able to 3 shot walls.

Btw, I don't need to hear how much I understand from you. I've been playing ID 7ish years now.
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Monkeysmine
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« Reply #18 on: May 23, 2012, 12:09:43 AM »

You're not hearing me. You're supposed to do this from the start to prevent him from being able to 3 shot walls.

Btw, I don't need to hear how much I understand from you. I've been playing ID 7ish years now.

And when he feeds on a bunch of other noobs who don't do the same thing?

Sorry. You're much better than Ry1d, Stealer and I.
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Frankjg
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« Reply #19 on: May 23, 2012, 12:17:27 AM »

Noobs break the game man, what can I tell you? I mean, you can scream "stop wallin out that far" just as much as you can scream "detonate workers". If they don't know why theyre doin it then they wont listen. Same thing, different skill level. I just don't wanna see any more of these threads talkin about "QQ we lost pls nerf".

Oh, and I'm not trying to say I'm better than anyone, just sayin im not some idiot gabbin about something he has no clue about. Trust me, I know when not to open my mouth. Seriously, you're not better than everyone, you got no right just puttin people down like that.
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relaets
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« Reply #20 on: May 23, 2012, 12:31:50 AM »

Noobs break the game man, what can I tell you? I mean, you can scream "stop wallin out that far" just as much as you can scream "detonate workers". If they don't know why theyre doin it then they wont listen.
Never complained once in this thread about how much feeding the titan got from the other players.
But since you brought up feeding; walls need a feeding nerf post-gp I feed like 2.5k that game and it was definitely 99% walls in that base.

Quote
Oh, and I'm not trying to say I'm better than anyone, just sayin im not some idiot gabbin about something he has no clue about.
Had us fooled.
Titan got no further to destroying that base any attack than he did the time before. Whenever he got close to committing to a base and didn't have blink/tp/ww to get away I killed him (had to do it twice cause of ankh).
He broke all the walls in the line of the base and would then have to instantly teleport away because he'd die if he tried to kill a tower and this repeated for the whole time; unless I got less lazy and walked into his path.

Quote
he was farming for a ridiculous amount of time.
GP+1H = 180g and it was over an hour of stalling.

I do wish you'd go towards clones+chaos though next time so that we could've combo'd him with 4 hunters (base,clone,x2 clones).

Quote
I've been playing ID 7ish years now.
definitely weren't playing the same ih's I was and considering I played with kyleep and crew you must've been in the bad end of the ID pool.

Quote
just sayin im not some idiot gabbin about something he has no clue about.
The fact that you called me a mag the entire time proves you have no idea what you're talking about cause if you watched the replay you'd notice (at least after the first hour) that I was a morphling.


-----
Back to the original point. Blink is an uncounterable escape skill and with a low cd it makes it impossible to kill that titan.
Any sort of debuff you use to counter blink can be dispelled.
Blink is instantaneous so you better do a damage combo but its easy to run away when you have half hp.
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Frankjg
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« Reply #21 on: May 23, 2012, 01:11:54 AM »

*Sigh*, again you take what I've said out of context so it's meaningless.

The only quote that works out of context is the only one I'll bother to respond to:
Quote
just sayin im not some idiot gabbin about something he has no clue about.
The fact that you called me a mag the entire time proves you have no idea what you're talking about cause if you watched the replay you'd notice (at least after the first hour) that I was a morphling.
I didn't have time to review any replays, my apologies. If you cared at all to think you could probably notice that it was a mistype. It happens to everyone, just relax.

You seem to have it in your head that I'm against you. At least, that's the vibe I'm getting. All I'm doing is giving you my opinion, I don't understand the personal attacks. Either way, like I said earlier, you're not better than everyone. Don't talk to me, or anyone else, like that. You don't deserve to, and neither does anyone else.
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Burn
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« Reply #22 on: May 23, 2012, 04:27:46 AM »

After the 3rd GP (or later/earlier depending on how fed the titan is) in an inhouse the titan should automatically forfeit/minion rush and admin !end the game. I'm not saying this should be implemented into Mbot rules because it shouldn't. For pubs, just leave the game after notifying your allies and assume you won, or just afk.

PS: You can ban for refusal to play the game and afk, but neither is the case in this scenario.

-Burn
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Metall-Drago
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« Reply #23 on: May 23, 2012, 05:39:04 AM »

But since you brought up feeding; walls need a feeding nerf post-gp I feed like 2.5k that game and it was definitely 99% walls in that base.

auto-froff broken i heard
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Frankjg
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« Reply #24 on: May 23, 2012, 06:59:04 AM »

I'd like to note that with well timed periodic disables it's actually possible to stop voltron from escaping with blink. I've timed myself, and it takes me roughly 1.5 seconds to punish my titan and immediately cast a targeted spell. Punish itself has a 3 second cooldown.

This means that on my own scale, a single disable will keep me from blinking for 1.5 seconds. A second one immediately after punish will take me an additional 4.5 (3.0+1.5) seconds to blink. That's six whole seconds delayed from blinking, which is pretty powerful. Plus, that's only two disables. The only catch is that you need to have disables available. Types of disables that stop you from blinking include:

Ensare (Troll Hunter expert training)
Bash (Tauren, Murloc hunter)
Status Trap (Goblin)
Stun arrow (Huntress)
Entangle (Nature Hunter expert training)

I'm sure there are plenty others but those are the ones off the top of my head.
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